Speaker 4: Hi I am Cynthia Butler, I am attorney [???] conflict resolution initiatives more on a case level as a litigator but, my question is you may [???] to Europe and attending more conservative and I watch France rather closely and you know, there has been recent rulings about no hijabs in public and schools and [???] and so my question is – is there a potential for dialogue to overcome the paranoia that is overcoming Europe right now about the invasion of the Muslims.  There is various [???] incredible paranoia, you can go to various lectures around town and hear it over and over that they are taking us over it is like the [???] invasion again you know.  And they look at things like no go zones and they look at things like you know, communities that have established their own little [???] principalities and so in terms of what is going on particularly in France, which I think is experiencing reactionary backlash with [???] turnover [???] you know, electorally, what would you suggest [???] perspective in terms of bettering the relations, I mean other than just setting up nice little conferences like this or [???] what could you suggest to infiltrate the political hierarchy to overcome.  I can’t [???] paranoia, I really can’t, I mean it is bizarre what kind of dialogue happens as a result of their, this [???] you know, fear [???].

Speaker 2: This is very interesting question, if I knew answer for this question, I would be now secretary of United Nation [???] but you are completely right and we see it all over and the issue as I told because I was student of identity for many, many years.  As I told you one of the major factors which we probably could not change but [???] is we always have stronger negative perceptions among people, more salient ethnic identities, stronger bias and discrimination when we have [???] issues.  So because it is first of all perceived as a [???] competition.  One of the grounds of it is this perception that Muslim immigrants are bringing in competition and if you look in United States there are some very interesting data that Muslim would speak about them as a minority, they are most educated one.  Muslim in United States are the most educated minority, mostly like 90% of Muslims have high education and it is huge in comparison with others.  The same data came from [???] region.  There are more educated women among Muslims than non-Muslims in Great Britain.  So we see it as a so this is one competition is real, [???] important point is [???] for identity.  You put it exactly right, for example in France there is now institute established by [???] Sarkozy, which preserves his aim to preserve French identity.  There is a policy now – there is a very interesting policy to support French cuisine, not just support, to preserve, it is in danger French cuisine from [???] huge heritage so we have to preserve so there are a lot of such discussion in France.  But we can go to any other country and see the same tendencies.  A lot of – mostly all institution now establishing – countries establishing institutes of national memory which try to preserve particularly and it is [???] organization [???] understand it again, everything is normal tendency of some identities [???] identities.  But if you put it together all this [???] sensitive, threat for identities, yes it has come to this very strong conservative [???] and again one of the ways to do it I believe because the strong boundary is created, more and more negative, I mean social boundary created between these two groups and you remember [???] told I think it was December last year, she told [???] rallies and doesn’t work for Germany.  And it is really strange because I just spent months last fall in one of the small towns in Germany with institute for study of history and actually bought all my food in a small Turkish like market near [???] because it was food which I used to – I mean I prefer Mediterranean type of food, not German type of food so I was like buying all food from this Turkish small market and you see a lot of connection.  People do go then by, but yes I spoke to people there and they told yes we have more and more differences, boundaries creating as a more importance in youth become more less tolerant than older people.  So I believe education of use [???] speak about citizenship, there is huge educational program of citizenship in Europe but unfortunately probably there are less and less emphasis on this interface tolerance and this citizenship issues. And the only way [???] there are probably a lot of different ways.  Policy have to be changed, the connection between communities have to be changed.  Its equation which becomes [???] presentation and [???]

Speaker 1: Yes we have been given the wrap up so I am going to have to thank both the audience and our delightful speaker Karina, thank you very much for coming today.  If you can please thank Karina and I look forward to seeing her again next time thank you.

Speaker 2: Okay thank you, and thank you for coming everyone, it was a pleasure.

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